Show Notes
In this episode of Enthusiastic Encouragement & Dubious Advice, Patricia and Nicole discuss the myth of moral superiority in doing things the hard way versus accepting help, especially around the holidays and everyday tasks. They share personal stories about overcoming the pressure to do everything from scratch, highlighting how accepting assistance can be just as valid and rewarding. The hosts encourage listeners to let go of unnecessary guilt, embrace community support, and find joy in making things easier for themselves.
Mentioned on the show:
- Bookshop Affiliate Storefront (links below are affiliate)
- Become a patron! Patreon.com/eedapod
- Subscribe to the ongoing Enthusiastic Encouragement & Dubious Advice Newsletter
- Our merch shop is open!
- Jen Zink’s GoFundMe
- C King Solutions
- C King Solutions Newsletter
- EEDA Pod: Everyone Deserves Help (Except for Me)
Find the full show notes and official transcript on our website: eedapod.com
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Sound editing by Jen Zink
Transcript
Music: [Intro Music]
Patricia: Hey there, jive turkeys. Welcome to Enthusiastic Encouragement and Dubious Advice, the podcast for folks who would rather curl into the fetal position than lean in. I’m your host, Patricia Elzie-Tuttle.
Nicole: And everybody scream! I’m Nicole Elzie-Tuttle. We’re recording this show on November 8th, 2025.
Patricia: Reminder that this podcast is independently run and we are hoping to be supported by listeners.
Downloading, sharing, and giving us reviews and ratings are free ways to show us support.
Nicole: And if you have a few bucks to donate, our Patreon memberships start at $3 a month. There are three tiers to choose from. And it’s that time of year for us to also remind you that you can gift a Patreon subscription to someone else.
We make an excellent gift.
Patricia: Speaking of gifts for you or yourself or other people. You or yourself? I love it. I wanna tell you about our bookshop affiliate site. There is a link on our homepage, eedapod.com. There is always a link in our show notes. And that is where we put all the books that we mention on this show, including, you know, when we do our end of year best books we read in the year.
Those books, any books we recommend, they’re all on this affiliate website and you can shop there and we get a little bit of money. And you’re also supporting independent bookstores when you shop at bookshop.org.
Nicole: If you need further things to gift. We also have a merch shop! You can find a link to our merch shop on our webpage at eedapod.com.
Patricia: Also, don’t forget, we always welcome emails about the self-help books you love or hate, and our email address is eedapod at gmail dot com.
One of the things when we were talking about going through a loved one’s things during our last episode, I realized there was a resource I should have shared that I completely spaced out about, so I wanna put that upfront.
I think the website is C King Solutions. And the woman is Courtney King. She is a woman here in Oakland, California, and she is a death doula. She helps people do Swedish death cleaning. She helps people go through the things of loved ones or also go through your own things. And she has a newsletter, and I have subscribed to her newsletter for years.
It’s very helpful. She also talks about, you know, things to get in order for, you know, end of life paperwork and also just like passwords and house keys and things like that. And there’s also a section of her newsletter, which is actually how I came to learn about her through a friend. A section of her newsletter called Auntie Prepper.
It is a weekly kind of list of something to get together for your emergency pack, emergency bin or bag, especially around natural disasters. And she talks more about like achievable things that also involve other people and it’s less like, I think as she says, like less bullets and beans and bunkers and more like realistic and not problematic prepping for the rest of us.
Nicole: Like a spare pair of underwear?
Patricia: At least a spare pair of underwear.
Nicole: I feel like that’s something not a lot of people remember to put in their emergency kits, and you will find very useful on like day three.
Patricia: I am like, oh, do we have spare underwear in our kits?
Nicole: Probably not.
Patricia: Okay, we’ll, we’ll have to do that.
The other thing I wanted to mention, ’cause we try to be really responsible on this show, is we have mentioned Buy Nothing groups on Facebook a lot.
I use ours for our neighborhood. And again, it’s a usually neighborhood Facebook group where, uh, everyone in your neighborhood’s in there, or at least everyone who wants to be. And I had, you know, some extra stickers and I was like, Hey, who wants stickers? We had some extra pasta sauce one time that wasn’t expired and someone else, but we weren’t going to eat it, and someone else was like, yeah, I’ll take that pasta sauce.
So the original guys who created Buy Nothing actually went private and for profit, and it’s like the Buy Nothing Project. And so there are, the Facebook groups aren’t associated with them, but you know, a lot of neighborhoods kept them going because of the spirit of the thing.
Apparently these guys are now going around and giving cease and desist to these neighborhood run Facebook groups for using the name. They’re getting groups shut down. Like one person I know her group in San Francisco that had like over 1500 people got shut down because of these guys. And I think it’s absolutely disgusting.
It’s absolutely disgusting, at a time when neighbors are in need of groceries and neighbors are trying to share groceries, to shut down these Facebook groups over a trademark. I think it’s low key evil. And so my neighborhood group has basically changed their name so we don’t get shut down. But that being said, I don’t know if you can really search for your buy nothing group on Facebook anymore.
It might be a neighborhood exchange group or something like that if you’re not already a part of it. And also, you know, F the buy nothing guys, apparently.
I feel like we’ve mentioned it enough on this show that I, I need to share it here.
Music: [Transition Music]
Patricia: So today I wanna talk about something that neither of us has fully learned. But yeah, I’ve been working on this for years and with the holidays coming up, I think it’s a good time for us to talk about it and put it up there. I have, and maybe you our listeners have it too, this false hierarchy that I clinging to in which doing something myself or doing something the hard way is at the very top and having help with doing the thing or doing something the easy way is at the very bottom.
We talked at length about needing help and accepting help in one of our early episodes title, Everyone Deserves Help (Except For Me), which we’ll link in the show notes. But today I really wanna talk about the idea of one way being better than the other way.
Nicole: I talked about this some in that episode.
Everyone Deserves Help (Except For Me). But I think this like idea goes back to this myth of rugged individualism in US culture. And I think this kind of exists to some extent in most capitalistic cultures, but because of the extreme consumerism in the US we’re pushed to be even more individualistic.
This individualism is necessary for the ever expanding drive for profit and growth under capitalism. For example, a neighborhood may only need one lawnmower if everyone works together in sharing it. But capitalism requires that every household needs its own lawnmower. Otherwise, how else is big lawnmower going to make a profit?
This in turn, creates a mindset that things done on our own are inherently better. I’m really starting to think that that can’t be further from the truth.
Patricia: Yeah. Down with big lawnmower! We don’t even have a lawn everyone.
You know, yes, it’s okay to be proud of yourself for doing something yourself, doing like doing something difficult, and I wanna share a different example. For instance, I would be very proud of myself if I made a pie crust from scratch.
Nicole: I would also be really impressed.
Patricia: I’m very intimidated by pies. I don’t know why. Every year I’m like, I’m gonna make a pie this year, and I don’t make a pie, but one of these days I’m gonna be brave enough.
Anyway, the issue is in thinking that it is somehow morally better than using store-bought. Like maybe it tastes better or maybe not, but it is not morally better because you do something from scratch. We just saw a video the other day of Mary Barry, who was one of the original people on the Great British Bake Off, and she admits that she buys store-bought puff pastry.
Nicole: [Gasp]
Patricia: She, I know, gasp. Escándalo. Like, um, and she was like, you know what? She’s like, I’m not making that all the time. And at this point she says, store-bought is better. Like they do it better than she does. And she readily admitted that. And I think of Ina Garten saying, you know, if you can’t make it yourself, store bought is fine. Like, it’s fine.
Nicole: Yeah.
Patricia: And I feel like this is also a conversation that goes around and around with garlic. Like fresh garlic versus jarred minced garlic, or as my friend Kat calls it, jarlic. I prefer the taste of fresh garlic and I don’t mind doing like, well, I do mind doing the garlic paperwork. Nicole’s looking at me.
Nicole: Yeah, I do a lot of the garlic paperwork for you.
Patricia: You do a lot of the garlic paperwork. I hate it, but you know, I don’t think I am somehow morally better for doing that than, than using jarred mix, minced garlic, which I grew up on a mix. Like sometimes my grandpa would use fresh garlic and sometimes we would use garlic for a jar.
Especially for like a big recipe.
Nicole: Yeah. We’re not gonna peel and mince like 20 heads of garlic.
Patricia: That sounds like a lot. That sounds like a lot. And I think what people aren’t like, they’re so close to getting, but they, they rarely do is the inherent ableism and classism in especially these food opinions that like, oh, these fresh things are better than these jarred things.
And there’s like, there’s so many problems with thinking that these things are morally better. And yeah, you may prefer the taste over, of one over the other. Like, we’re not saying that. We’re saying like, you are not morally better for doing things from scratch.
Nicole: This is also seen a lot in, as we’re coming up to the holidays, so many people convince themselves that on a holiday like American Thanksgiving, it’s only good if they have all of the traditional foods and people spend multiple days cooking. Like the holiday’s only good if someone’s running themselves into the ground, and that someone or someone’s just happens to be women most of the time. It’s as though it’s as though the suffering makes it taste better.
Patricia: The resentment?
Nicole: Yes.
Patricia: Wow. Is this, is this fresh resentment in this pumpkin pie?
Nicole: Mmm.
Patricia: Mmm, just like mom used to make.
Nicole: Oh, oh, I blew us out.
Patricia: Yep.
Nicole: Um, I blew us out, I guess, with that fresh resentment.
Patricia: Yeah, that fresh I gotcha on that one. Yeah.
Nicole: Yeah, you did.
For the record though, F Thanksgiving.
Patricia: F Thanksgiving.
Nicole: Yeah. We’re just
Patricia: for real.
Nicole: Oh my gosh.
Patricia: I know that you and I have been rethinking holiday gifts this year and not making our usual like what, like 1600 marshmallows from scratch. And I am having such a hard time not beating myself up for not making these elaborate candies and trying to convince myself that different gifts can also be good.
Nicole: Yeah.
Patricia: The other day, I didn’t tell you this, the other day my therapist was like, so hey, I looked up what it takes to make marshmallows from scratch, and then she gave me like a look and she is like, yeah, I’m glad you’re not doing this yet again this year.
Nicole: Yeah.
Patricia: Not that we aren’t making marshmallows at all.
Nicole: But just not,
Patricia: not 60 hours and 1600 marshmallows
Nicole: over the course of like two months.
Patricia: Yeah.
Nicole: I’m not gonna look like a fiddler crab by the end of it.
I think a really good of example of like what we’re getting at here was when I was looking for a therapist a handful of years ago.
I was set on doing this myself. I made a spreadsheet. I was looking people up. I was trying to get everything together, and I would schedule a first couple of appointments with someone. And like, I’m pretty sure one of them was drunk, like extremely unprofessional, and just unknowledgeable. It was surprising ’cause they came so well recommended. But like I went through a couple of people, and this whole time you were like, would you like some assistance with this? And I was very much like, no, I can do it myself. As though there was something more noble in finding a therapist myself. In the end, I was finally like, yes, please help me.
And the extent of your help was just like asking your therapist
Patricia: for referrals.
Nicole: For referrals. Like it was not a big lift at all.
Patricia: Yeah. And correct me if I’m wrong, but you also seem to have a sense of like, I should be able to do this myself.
Nicole: Oh, definitely. Like I, I, with a psychology degree was like, I should be able to find a therapist.
Patricia: And not saying that you couldn’t. Right? I think a lot of, a lot of individuals do and a lot of individuals can, but I think
Nicole: it would’ve expend a lot more effort and misery.
Patricia: Yeah. And you were also like, so dead sense that that finding yourself was somehow better?
Nicole: Yes.
Looking back, this is wild. Because what I was in fact doing was not wanting to accept help in finding someone to help me.
I had this kind of epiphany as we were like putting this together last night, and it was just like, oh wow. Not wanting to find help in finding someone whose job it is to help me.
Patricia: Huh.
Nicole: Huh. When you phrase it like that,
Patricia: it’s real silly. Like it’s real silly.
Nicole: But really, like I was, I, I felt like I had to do it on my own and it would be a better, I don’t know better what?
I don’t know. It would just be better.
Patricia: And in the end, my therapist at the time gave you a list of people like, hey, here’s some people that I think Nicole will find a good fit. And I handed the list to you. Right?
Nicole: I looked them up and like, one of them was great. She’s great.
Patricia: Yep. And you still have her?
Nicole: Yep.
Patricia: Yep.
I think about this idea of something being morally better or not a lot with job hunting as well. Especially, or specifically, for BIPOC and queer people. As someone who went to undergrad with a plethora of mediocre, wealthy people, I will remind you that they have no qualms about reaching out to someone they know at a company for a referral, whether or not there is an actual referral program that they know of.
I really wanna stress this here. I’m putting my mentor hat on. There is more than one way to refer someone. Their ha- doesn’t have to be an actual referral program. Don’t assume there isn’t. Don’t assume there isn’t because of where they work. Like, oh, that’s not what, how universities work, or, oh, that’s not how retail works, or that’s not how you know, blah, blah, blah, blah.
I promise you, if you know someone there, they could probably figure out a way to slip your name in there.
Nicole: Absolutely.
Patricia: And I think about like, LinkedIn had almost $18 billion in revenue in fiscal year 2025. LinkedIn is a site that was built on the idea of networking and connecting to people at companies you want to be at or collaborate with or whatever.
So again, for BIPOC and queer people, you aren’t less than for leveraging connections in your job search. And I think about that a lot. Especially like a job I had in the past was like someone I knew and thinking about like, oh, I didn’t deserve it ’cause someone I knew was there. But yeah, it’s just, it’s a thing that we can beat ourselves up over.
Nicole: Yeah.
Ultimately, I think what we’re trying to say here is just because something is difficult doesn’t make it inherently better, or just because someone does something the hard way doesn’t mean they’re a better person. Homemade Doritos are not gonna be good as store-bought. I’m just laying that flat out there.
One. Good luck trying to nail down that cool ranch flavor. But two, no matter how many hours you spend in the kitchen trying to make a Dorito, everyone’s gonna be real disappointed when you don’t bring that blue bag to the party, if you said you were bringing Doritos.
Patricia: I was just thinking if I had a cool ranch spice mix, I’d be unstoppable.
I’d make cool ranch eggs.
Nicole: Oh no.
Patricia: I’d make cool ranch everything.
Nicole: Is this our secret holiday gift we’re gonna try to put together?
Patricia: We’re gonna try to figure out a cool ranch spice mix.
Nicole: Then do we like try to grow the spices for next year?
Patricia: N no.
No.
Nicole: No.
Patricia: No.
Nicole: Okay.
Patricia: That’s, I feel that would be too much. How do, how do you even grow a ranch.
Anyway. I know the saying existed long before I heard it, but in Ducktails
Nicole: woo-oo
Patricia: woo-oo
Scrooge McDuck taught me to work smarter, not harder. And I really try to hold onto that. I’m like, what is, what is the easiest way to do this thing?
Nicole: Well, if you learn from Launchpad McQuack, it’s to run around on one wheel.
Patricia: Yeah. Robodoc.
Nicole: That’s right.
Patricia: Roboduck!.
Nicole: I got my characters mixed up again.
Patricia: No, but didn’t he turn into Robuck?
Nicole: Oh, was that his secret identity?
Patricia: I don’t remember now. Now we have to watch some Ducktails.
Nicole: If there’s a Ducktails like nerd out there, please don’t like angrily write us in.
Patricia: Actually, you know what?
If there’s a ducktails connoisseur out there yes, write, write to us.
Nicole: No, write to us. Just don’t be angry about it, please. I’m delicate.
Okay, so work smarter or not harder unless it’s using AI for art.
Patricia: Yeah, using generative AI for a quote unquote art that is an example of where the harder way is, the better way. And I stand by that.
Nicole: I stand on that too. And we’re not gonna say anything more about that right now.
Patricia: Nope. Line drawn. Line drawn ourselves with my hand and a pencil.
Music: [Transition Music]
Nicole: Okay, Patricia, we yapped a bit. What do you wanna make sure people take away from this episode?
Patricia: I want people to take away that having help doing something doesn’t make it less of an achievement. Nicole, how about you?
Nicole: Yeah, I’m just gonna like stand on that with you. Doing something on your own doesn’t make that thing better if you got help or had someone else do it. We can give one more example of this. I know we’re trying to wrap up, but this gets real obvious when it comes to things like plumbing if you’re not a plumber.
Patricia: Yeah. I mean, sometimes you could work a thing out and it’s okay to call in the professionals.
Nicole: Yeah.
Patricia: In fact, with some things, please call in the professionals.
Nicole: Yeah.
Ooh, what’s been filling your cup lately?
Patricia: So it is the time of year where we start working on our holiday cards. We actually order, already designed our cards, ordered our cards. The cards arrived on Halloween. I usually do that bit in October. And now I’ve been kind of gathering the supplies for what I want the envelopes to look like.
Usually it’s very sticker heavy and I’ve run through most of our holiday stickers. Which like a lot of snowflakes and stuff like that. So I think this year I’m leaning into the rubber stamps, which then we could use on other mail and in future years. So I’m waiting for a few more stamps to arrive.
Including some very special stamps that we’ll be sure to share online once those arrive. I’m very excited. And I don’t know, I just love, I love holiday cards. It’s also the time of year where we reach out to people to confirm addresses. And it always ends up in a little kind of text catch up yearly. Like, Hey, how are you? Have you moved? Has your name changed? Are the people in your household different? And that’s always like, it’s like a built-in annual check-in, and I really like that.
Nicole, what’s filling your cup?
Nicole: This past week on Halloween, the new Florence and the Machine album dropped, titled Everybody Scream. I’ve been listening to it a lot. I got my vinyl record copy in the mail. So I’m very excited to be listening to that on big speakers and not headphones. And I feel like that’s gonna be, uh, the album that gets me through this winter.
Patricia: Yeah. And also the, the one you got has like gorgeous photography, like
Nicole: Oh yeah.
Patricia: Ugh. So good.
Nicole: Yeah.
Patricia: Well, that’s our show for today, we’d like to thank our awesome audio editor, Jen Zink. You can find her at loopdilou.com. We’ll leave a link to that in our show notes.
Nicole: You can find the full show notes and transcript at eedapod.com. That’s E-E-D-A-P-O-D dot com. There, you can also find a link to our Patreon, our Bookshop link, and a link to the ongoing, Enthusiastic Encouragement and Dubious Advice newsletter.
Patricia: You can also find us on Instagram and Blue Sky at eepdapod and email us at eedapod at gmail dot com. That was your line.
Nicole: But we are nothing if not consistent! We would also appreciate it so much if you would subscribe and rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube or wherever else you get your podcasts that allow for ratings. It goes really far in helping other people find us.
And if you would like to leave us a comment, you can do so at any places I just named, or email us.
Patricia: We would also appreciate anyone who can subscribe to us on Patreon, support is going to help us keep the show going, especially without ads. You can find us at patreon.com/eedapod.
In the meantime, we hope you find ways to be kind to yourself, drink some water and read a book. We’ll be talking to you soon.
Nicole: Oh, I didn’t write anything down.
Patricia: [The sound Blue from Blues Clues makes to indicate “I don’t know”]